Tuesday, December 21, 2010

Security Expert on Random Bag Searches

This morning's bag checks at Braddock Rd. via @deafinthecity. "These were taken while I was on the platform. Once again, I was running late for work so I took the rail today. I was surprised they were doing bag checks at Braddock Road. I guess it's a high crime area and full of gangsta workers like myself.


Unsuck reached out to Bruce Schneier who, according to his website, is "an internationally renowned security technologist and author. Described by The Economist as a 'security guru,' he is best known as a refreshingly candid and lucid security critic and commentator. When people want to know how security really works, they turn to Schneier."

He wrote about random bag searches on his blog back in 2005, when the New York subway implemented them. Below is an excerpt from his post. He said in an email he'd not changed his opinion.
It's another "movie plot threat." It's another "public relations security system." It's a waste of money, it substantially reduces our liberties, and it won't make us any safer.

Final note: I often get comments along the lines of "Stop criticizing stuff; tell us what we should do." My answer is always the same. Counterterrorism is most effective when it doesn't make arbitrary assumptions about the terrorists' plans. Stop searching bags on the subways, and spend the money on 1) intelligence and investigation -- stopping the terrorists regardless of what their plans are, and 2) emergency response -- lessening the impact of a terrorist attack, regardless of what the plans are. Countermeasures that defend against particular targets, or assume particular tactics, or cause the terrorists to make insignificant modifications in their plans, or that surveil the entire population looking for the few terrorists, are largely not worth it.
Other items:
Metro to spend $1.2 million on guerrilla marketing (Examiner)
Board forms committee (Examiner)
Board members whine (WaPo)
Wonder how much stuff like this goes on (Washington Times)
Alert operator saves life (Examiner)

Comments (60)

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Corresponding Toads's avatar

Corresponding Toads · 744 weeks ago

Movie plot threat? More like this movie sucks.
1 reply · active less than 1 minute ago
It does reduce our liberties. What we need to do is be willing to be arrested for asserting our liberties. As a federal attorney I swore an oath to "uphold and defend the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic." That means on my way to work, to play, to drink, to get home, if a police officer asks to search my bag without a warrant I will refuse and attempt to enter the system regardless of his commands. An unconstitutional order not to enter a public space is an illegal order. I will take the trespassing arrest and I will sue for civil and constitutional rights violations. The judgment against Metro and against the legality of these searches will be more than worth the hassle of a few hours in the pokey and couple of days in court.
6 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
Wish I could. I spend so much on Metro just getting to work I do not have the extra cash for lawsuits...
The ACLU or another Constitutional Rights organization will likely take the case. Although I'm more than wiling to sue on my own behalf.
What is the legal definition of "Public Space" and how might it apply (or not apply) to Metro stations or bus stops?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_space#Restric...

Semi-public, my bad. But I'm willing to push the issue.
Your a federal attorney and you dont even know the law. WOW.....no wonder all these crooks get away with everything.
They make it up as they go along and hope nobody notices.
I walked through the Braddock Road station this morning without the police trying to search me, although I carry an over the shoulder bag with my metro reading material and take-home work. It was not clear to me whether they were forcing people to submit to a search, or simply searching the sheep who volunteered by going over to the search table.
2 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
I too also went through Braddock Road today, and I agree: the cop was giving feeble, almost silent hello's and smiling sheepishly, like it was some kind of pilot program they were embarrassed of. It seems like the only people getting their bags searched were the ones stupid enough to make eye contact with the cops.

But seriously, what are they going to do if you walk on by and pretend not to hear them? Tackle you?
As I mentioned in a lengthy post on the original bag search thread, the "sheep" are chosen mathematically (e.g. every 10th person with a bag, every 20th person with a bag). It's a random bag check, not a "search everyone because there is an immediate threat" check.
Best post on this whole debacle I've seen. All you need to know.
Metro is a semi-public entity. It is not a right to ride metro it is a privelege. They have the right to refuse anyone to ride that doesnt follow the policies and laws that govern metro. As for the retarded federal attorney up above....metro works just like someone trespassing on your property. You ask them to leave...if they leave they are good...if they refuse to leave then they are subject to arrest. Go read the law you federal attorney lol. You can find it on the internet lol.
11 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
Corresponding Toads's avatar

Corresponding Toads · 744 weeks ago

hi dunker,

thanks for the slam dunk!

dunk slammin and space jammin,

ct
Too bad those same principles don't apply to Metro employees.
uh.. dunker it is a bad idea to throw stones when you live in a glass house. "privelege?"
As long as one hits you I am ok.
Maybe we should send the stone squat after you dunker. Credible threats of violence...hmm so much for your concerns about safety.
Metro is a public transit agency. See "public"

"In 1966, a bill creating WMATA was passed by the federal government, the District of Columbia, Virginia, and Maryland,[8] with planning power for the system being transferred to it from the NCTA.[9]"

Again, a federally created transit agency is a public transit agency and system, hence public.
So is Ft. Meade and the NSA building there. Go ahead and just walk in and say "This is a public area, I have the right to be here" and see how that works out for you.

Publicly owned does not mean publicly open.
That would be hilarious but some of these people on here would complain about their policies as well. They would complain if they were given free gas for life or no taxes.
But they are also a business and if they want to make money they need to meet the needs of the customer.
HENCE. Well all stores and bars and restuarants are public but you can be arrested for trespassing if you refused to leave. Point null and void. If you dont like Metro dont ride it. One less ass to take up my seat.
Dunker, what you are missing is as less people ride metro, revenue will decrease and then as a result of that they will make service cuts or increase the fair or both. So you will loose out too when others stop riding. The money won't ever come from cuts to the top.
It's been said before but it's so true it needs to be said again: If Metro can't stop gangs of youth from beating each other during rush hour inside of busy stations, I have absolutely, positively 0% confidence that they would be able to stop a group of people so determined to kill Americans that they flew jetliners into buildings.

Terrorist #1: “Alright Yusuf, go inside and call me if they’re doing bag checks.”
Terrorist #2: “Yeah, it looks like they are.”
Terrorist #1: “That’s alright, we’ll just drive to the next one.”

It doesn't even give the illusion of security; it exudes the reality of the pitiful times we have the misfortune of living in.
2 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
VeggieTart's avatar

VeggieTart · 744 weeks ago

And if you catch a train in an area with enough stations or station entrances, you can walk a few blocks to where they aren't doing searches.
The bizzare part is even if some makes threats of violence it will be completely ignored. There was a guy on the metro bus I was riding Monday night high as a kite, screaming into the air about how he was going to kill some guy, making gun noises, and screaming about his plans to do so. Metro bus driver reaction: nothing. Number of police on the scene: zero.
It has begun and is as bad we all predicted on this blog. WTOP excerpt...

"At Braddock Metro, one man was stopped for about 8 minutes because there was some sort of chemical substance on his bag. Police X-rayed the bag and went through it, finding nothing. They also took his his identification and questioned him.

Another woman, who did not object to the bag screening, was stopped for 45 seconds. She missed her train as her bag of Christmas presents was searched. "

DO NOT wash your tote bags!. "Household chemicals" are a bad bad thing. I just wonder how much of that first delay was because the "inspector" wore his work gloves which might have been tainted from his own use?
2 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
"Household chemicals." Is Metro now saying we should all live in dirty homes with dirty clothes? Considering how filty Metro is... What if the "household chemical" positive result came from holding onto the handrail of the escalator? Ever smelled that crap they use to fake-clean the handrails?
why not employ cops to ride/walk through the trains and on the platforms... a mere presence would be a deterrent not only for "terror" but more for the day to day terror and malevolent behavior regularly on Metro... this is theater along with all the terror drills that they have... it's quite comical

(like last week, some kid lit a blunt on the train) i m more concerned about that type of nonsense than worrying about the boogie-terrorist man
Keep Fear Alive's avatar

Keep Fear Alive · 744 weeks ago

I am concerned by the picture of the security table. Isn't this considered "casing" the Metro system? Was the picture taken by a Brown Person? How do you distinguish this from attempted terrorism? I hope the FBI pays you a visit. Taking pictures in a public place is a no-no!
5 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
Uh, since when? Here in America you have the freedom to take pictures in a public place.Tourists do it all the time in Metro.
Keep Fear Alive, it looks like you need to include captions for the humor-impaired.
Metro came out a few months ago and mentioned pics are ok except please do not flash-snap an incoming train or you blind the driver. Heaven knows, they are blind enough as it is.... ;)
Amen. These people think its a joke till the FBI comes knocking at their door.
It must be asked: if this bag search regime has a serious purpose, then what is it serious about?

It's clearly not serious about catching bad guys. If it were, there would be far more inspections at every single station, at all times--not just an hour of inspections here and there at one or two stations.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: even if you inspected one bag of every three in the system, at all times, the bad guys luck out 66% of the time. Metro's not even doing THAT much, so the bad guys luck out even more often. So what are we up to? 75% in favor of the bad guys? 80? Worse than that? So this cannot be a serious effort to catch bad guys. If that really is the designed serious purpose--which I doubt--then Metro needs to either step it up dramatically, or bring the curtain down on this theater.

I don't think that's the serious purpose here, though. Honestly, I don't. I think the serious purpose here is to get us all conditioned to police state tactics.

What else can it be? The purpose cannot seriously be to catch bad guys, or the searches would be system-wide, and constant. Anything less than that, and it cannot catch bad guys, BY DESIGN. To be effective, a bag search program would have to be quite vast. Metro's effort here doesn't even seem to rise to the level of half vast.

Now, if I'm wrong about this--which I hope I am--and whoever came up with this half-baked idea sincerely thought that this would be an effective way to stop terrorists, they need to be let go for gross incompetence.

The only serious purpose I can see being accomplished here, is getting Metro riders accustomed to surrendering their freedom.
1 reply · active 744 weeks ago
It also won't work because the checks are random and that can't force you to submit to them, so if someone has a bomb/weapon, etc they will just leave and try again later.
1 reply · active less than 1 minute ago
They cannot force you to submit but then you cannot get to work (if you have no car). It's force.
Heres an Idea: bombard WMATA with all sorts of complaints, calls, etc... as tomorrow is FESTIVUS, and what better day for the Airing of Grievances against METRO!!!!
3 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
I gotta lot of problems with you people!
Gotta ask... so why do you bother to read/post to this blog? :)
And you wonder why metro is falling apart with idiots like you.
Looks to me like there are blocking the firefighting room..hey fire marshall what up with that..and loitering on metro property
Corresponding Toads's avatar

Corresponding Toads · 744 weeks ago

There will be a breaking news story within the next couple of weeks. It will read something like this:

RANDOM SEARCH BY METRO POLICE THWARTS APPARENT BOMBING ATTEMPT

Don't believe a word of it.
2 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
VeggieTart's avatar

VeggieTart · 744 weeks ago

Yeah, it'll probably be in "The Onion".
When you hear a story about a "suspicious" lady hanging out around King Street Metro on Friday that is just me waiting for my friend. And given the ridiculous nature of their other imaginary excuses (aka the guy who forgot his bag by the fare machine and said when someone told him that, he was "lucky" aka lucky to not have it stolen by some teenage gangster..um yeah who knows maybe I'll be in the papers next. And I might even bring a bag...and it could be a health hazard-after all I might just have to stop at dunken donuts on the way-definitly a delicious health hazard I would say!
Xmas and On-Anon's avatar

Xmas and On-Anon · 744 weeks ago

Wonder how much revenue metro will now lose from airport travelers who will no longer take the subway to the airport. Can you envision TWO checks instead of the usual intensive one at the airport?

Happy Holidays Unsuck and to my fellow readers!
Thanks on-anon!
Happy Holiday's also Unsuck and thank you for your constant inquires which assist public safety!
A GREAT Work that you do!
1 reply · active less than 1 minute ago
Assist safety. LMAO. what a joke.
Random bag searches ... I'd feel safer with metal detectors at the fare card machines, screen out some of those knives and guns.
I saw 5 Metro Transit cops, a TSA employee (?!?), and a guy with a vest that said "DHS Police" at Foggy Bottom this morning. One of them had a dog, sniffing for bombs or drugs I suppose. WHY THE HECK ARE THEY PUTTING 6 COPS IN ONE STATION? AND FOR PETE'S SAKE, A TSA PERSON, TOO? THE MADNESS CONTINUES.
2 replies · active less than 1 minute ago
GDopplerXT's avatar

GDopplerXT · 743 weeks ago

The "TS" in TSA stands for "Transportation Security", so it should be fairly obvious why they would put a TSA guy there with the other police. (Whether or not they were doing anything useful is a different question.)
GDopplerXT's avatar

GDopplerXT · 743 weeks ago

More info here: http://www.tsa.gov/who_we_are/index.shtm

Note the part where it says "we patrol subways with our law enforcement partners".
Few questions for those of you who are still riding daily:
1. Are they still doing these nonsense bag checks?
2. If you bring a small purse are they going to stop and harass you over that if your number comes up?
3. Is there a place to find out if the fascists have shown up to do bag checks at your metro stations of choice?
I saw these clowns at Bethesda metro this morning. They didn't pick me out, but I was like come on, put a hand on me, see if I don't slap a 42 USC 1983 lawsuit on you douchebags

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