Wednesday, February 13, 2013

Riders Give Details of Possible Metro Creepers



From an anonymous reader:
Be on the lookout for a armed, black male, mid to late 20s, 160-185 pounds, who dresses high-end urban casual who is robbing people between Potomac Ave. and Minnesota Ave. in the evening rush.

 I was his target just three Tuesday evenings ago, and he shoved a gun in my side and took everything on my person

He was wearing very nice back twill pants, a neon green shell jacket a baseball cap that had Raptors basketball logo on it.  He had an RG III haircut and was drunk.

Do what he says and get a call to 911 ASAP.
There are some reports of armed robberies on this segment on the latest Metro Transit Police blotter from December.

Another reader warns of a possible stalker. She said he's a 40-55 year-old Caucasian male, 6'-6'3", thin with thinning, light brown hair and balding at the top. He has thin, metal, Harry Potter-shaped glasses, light colored eyes (semi close together), large pointy noise and tends to swivel head often. He wears casual slacks, layered professional jackets, and solid black gym shoes.

The reader claims to have had five encounters with the man, four of them on the Orange Line. The encounters all involve what they called intense, menacing staring. The woman said it was so bad that she felt "threatened and extremely uncomfortable."

In one encounter:
He literally followed me off the same car of a Metro train despite him being in mid-squat about to sit down when he realized I was getting off. Immediately, after I exited the train, I boarded the train across the platform. The doors shut, and I spotted the man looking confusedly around on the platform, standing in the same place, when he made eye contact with me through the train doors and stared at me until my train departed. 
And in another encounter:
At Metro Center on the Orange line to New Carrollton platform, I was alone waiting on the train. The train approached, and I boarded, sat down, looked up and suddenly the man was there when I had not noticed him on the platform. Yet he boarded behind me. He would not stop staring at me even after I stared back at him to communicate that I was feeling threatened by him. He kept staring and was looking at my things, so I did not want to pull out any personal items or give him any hints of who I was. I felt so threatened, I exited the train at Smithsonian station. He continued to stare at me through the window, sitting in the seat I was just in, until the train departed. 
The reader said she'dcalled Metro Transit Police about the man, but they "recommend taking a picture of him and reporting him. The police cannot currently act upon this report because no physical harassment has been committed."
I am not one to keep riding the Metro to wait until that does happen. Please contact police if you see this man. Note that no verbal communication has been made so there is no voice description for this man.
Other items:
99 harassment cases reported to Metro (Examiner)
Study casts doubt on rapid bus transit in MoCo (WaPo)
Metro tries to lure FBI to PG (WaPo)
Metro's legal bills for Red Line crash cases reach $7.5 million (WaPo)

Comments (76)

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Maybe the guy from the second story is just bad at flirting.
6 replies · active 631 weeks ago
he's too old to be doing that to a young girl.. why always the same person? directly following her on or off a train and also suddenly appearing out of nowhere to her (as if she didn't see him right before)? whether he's mental or not the behavior isn't right.
One person's harassment is another person's flirting.
http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/192206/373/Is-S...
"One person's harassment is another person's flirting." - Actually I think this is the one statement I've ever seen Dan Stessel say that has some truth to it. Sometimes it's obvious, but when it's not what do you do? The same problem exists in bars and nightclubs, it's a cultural problem with no "solution" other than to ditch public transit.

Of course if the government was vastly smaller, like it should be, and/or more spread out over a larger area, metro would become obsolete and there would be plenty of driving & parking space everywhere...
Ever Worried's avatar

Ever Worried · 631 weeks ago

That is not funny, even satirically.
Hah, no it's obvious in that case that she has a stalker problem. Creepy idiots like this must have a few screws loose, any normal person should "get" that such behavior isn't the social norm. And the police (yet another government service failure) should do something about even this if a complain is made. Probably just a warning to give the benefit of the doubt to the socially clueless. But after a warning this creep should be arrested... it's obviously a form of aggression on the part of the creep if he continues his behavior despite being informed that it's making someone feel uncomfortable. The repetitious nature makes it clear that something is wrong here.
Really? Seriously? Arrest someone for "staring"?
One man's menacing stare is another man's cheery hello.
Cletus Jenkins's avatar

Cletus Jenkins · 631 weeks ago

Sounds like that guy needs Doctor Love to teach him how to properly get a woman's number.
you know when you feel somebody staring at you and so you stare back at them and briefly make eye contact with them and expect them to look away because you caught them staring at you? try that 3 times in one train ride as a 23 year old female to a 50 yr old man and not succeeding at it. literally watching you every move, from taking you headphones out to your hands and what you holding and not releasing his stare. everybody else on the train noticing.. it's not right. would you confront them back?
Wtf is wrong with people? What does a creep like that hope to accomplish with this? Nasty fu@ker!
Staring back is a great idea if you're dealing with normal people, like your annoying brother or whatever, but not if you're dealing with a stranger. Consider the stare a warning. Remove yourself from the person's line of sight without acknowledging him, get on another train if necessary, even it means going out of your way. Put distance between yourself and any possible threat.
So now it's harrasment to look at someone in public? Maybe everyone on Metro should be required to wear dark glasses so nobody gets offended!
6 replies · active 631 weeks ago
would you wait until real harassment happened?
Um...yes? Until and unless real harassment happens, what exactly would you suggest the police do? Charge him with a pre-crime? This guy sounds like a weirdo and I sympathize with anyone being made to feel uncomfortable or unsafe in public, but being a creepy weirdo is generally not a crime.
they file a complaint, communicate his description to the officers who will be patroling the stations during roll call, and inquire his destination and name if he is spotted.

glad to hear you like getting touched by strangers!
I did not say that I like being touched by strangers; I said that it's not generally illegal to be creapy weirdos. Please read carefully and respond only to what people actually write. If he had actually touched someone, or made any threatening action of any kind, it would be a very different situation. Thus far, however, he has apparently merely stared at someone.

You suggest that the police could question him, but since it doesn't sound as though he has done anything illegal, he could simply answer any police questions with "that's none of your business," and the police would have no legal basis for hassling him further. Short of assigning an officer to follow him everywhere, I don't see what the police could reasonably do.
The article says that he was looking at people, not touching them. Legally, that's a big distinction.

You know, since one is a crime and the other isn't.
Really now's avatar

Really now · 631 weeks ago

Come back and say that when the other guy puts his gun in your ribs.
I thought gun laws were supposed to stop criminals from robbing at gunpoint? I'd write your congressman/woman and get them to impose strict enforcement of laws onto criminals!
10 replies · active 631 weeks ago
Teabag Me's avatar

Teabag Me · 631 weeks ago

Why does this site attract so many Teabaggers? You'd think rethuglicans wouldn't ride metro because it is devil urban public transit and they'd prefer the american freedom of sitting in traffic.
With transit subsides financially penalizing you for not taking metro and the amount of traffic a FAR too large and bloated government creates, is there really a fair choice? You have to decide whether to pay more, waste more time, and deal with all the hassles of driving in weather and so on; or risk your life, property, and dignity riding a system run by racist, sexist, incompetent, lazy "nepotists". Perhaps if you weren't such a politically polarized hater you'd be able to see that not everyone who disagrees with your big government robin hood mentality is a wealthy, greedy bigot.
Not going to get much love on here from that comment. It's mostly Libs that read this and complain about first world problems.
I was under the impression that this site attracted people from all over the political spectrum who ride or encounter metro.
I don't think anyone is asking to give every man, woman, and child a firearm. I wasn't.

I hate to deviate from the problem of crimes on metro, but an AWB solves very little of the day-to-day crime like this one reported above.

also, what makes you think I'm "conservative" because of one view/opinion? If we all thought the same, we'd have no need to be human and unique.

We all can agree that we should work to get WATA to unsuck !
And "teabagger" is a very homophobic term. Liberals should be ashamed by those who use it.
I didn't know this site had a target political persuasion.

I thought Metro's ridiculousness united all of mankind, regardless of age, race, creed, color, sex, sexual orientation, gender identity, national origin, religion or disability.
As a woman rider, I'm amazed at the insensitive comments obviously made my male riders about staring. There are many types. This one sounds like something I'd report too.
7 replies · active 631 weeks ago
hrh king friday 13's avatar

hrh king friday 13 · 631 weeks ago

Yeah but you gotta admit it's kind of weird the female rider thought the best way to deal with a staring guy is to stare back at him. I'm more alarmed by the guy with the gun.
how else would you respond? please see comment below and sincerely would like to know your thoughts
hrh king friday 13's avatar

hrh king friday 13 · 631 weeks ago

Sincerely... not by staring back at him/her! If you going to make prolonged eye contact with someone like that, why not just give him your number and ask him to call you so you can tell him you're not intereseted? Or sincerely give him a prefume scented heart-shaped notes saying how uncomfortable he's making you feel?

No. I'd confront him/her verbally, perhaps loudly enough to embarrass the crap out of him/her and draw attention to the situation. Sincerely.
Not everyone is as outgoing and daring as you apparently are. I sympathize with someone being 'harassed/annoyed/bothered' or whatever you'd call it by some creep like this. And in the case described it's DEFINITELY creepy stalking, I don't even know what could be done about that other than going to a station manager to report & see what the creep response is... it's not like 'metro police' are ever around.
I know seriously. I'm a male rider and I've had so many females look at me like a piece of meat. I've seen them lick their lips at me and bat their eyes. Goddamn creeps. One of them had the audacity to say "hi" to me and "can you please move" when they were sitting on the inside seat. I can't stand being in a public place riding mass transit anymore.
Next time some disgusting female does that I'm calling metro police and letting them deal with the harasser.
thanks Guest. Did you know someone on the train just two evenings ago got stabbed? there are creepers EVERYWHERE- and it blows my mind how ignorant people are. just for kicks and giggles- go to Washington Post mug shots- look how many CONVICTED MURDERERS there are documented- all events which have happened recently. you'd be ridicuously surprised. or maybe not since you seem to have sense and go with your gut. I recommend all others, then, to do this.
Report for staring in the first degree. Aggrevated staring?
hrh king friday 13's avatar

hrh king friday 13 · 631 weeks ago

Awww, these are like Metro Valentines.
1 reply · active 631 weeks ago
Ralph Wiggum's avatar

Ralph Wiggum · 631 weeks ago

"It says 'Let's Bee Friends', and there's a picture of a bee on it!"
Since when is staring a crime?
2 replies · active 631 weeks ago
GG Allin, would you wait until someone got touched? especially when it's been the same person-
Of course not. If some one feels uncomfortable, they should report it. Police may or may not investigate or decide that such investigation does not show evidence of a crime.
also doesn't make sense to see him in Rosslyn one location (east) during a weekday at night, and then in Metro center often in the morning.. where is he going? to work? doubt it.
I am also super suprised at some of these insensitive comments! Of course its not a crime to look at someone else, but you have all had that "feeling" when you KNOW its not right and you should trust it.
you know when you feel somebody staring at you and so you stare back at them and briefly make eye contact with them and expect them to look away because you caught them staring at you?
try that 3 times in one train ride as a 23 year old female to a 50 yr old man and not succeeding at it.
...literally watching you every move, from taking your headphones out to your hands and what you're holding and not releasing his stare. everybody else on the train noticing, too.. it's not right. would you confront them back? or what else would you do without getting off the train?
you can't call, service is bad. you don't want to yell back no matter how frustrated you are, because
A., what if they are unstable, and
B., what if they have a knife, gun, you DON'T know.
not gonna stay on the train and ride all the way to New Carrollton and just hope he gets off before that.. wouldn't even want him knowing that's where I'd be headed!
3 replies · active 631 weeks ago
Exactly. I had an issue with a guy who pushed me at WFC platform, and I pushed back. He had the cajones to say "I" was crazy (seriously, dude??) and kept following me, trying to take my picture. I got off at EFC and waited for the next train to keep him from following me.

There are some real nutjobs here in the DC area. Makes me glad that I'm slugging for the most part, now.
EggbertMcDuckenstein's avatar

EggbertMcDuckenstein · 631 weeks ago

If you shoved me, I'd probably take your picture and report you.

I had a women who failed to heed to the "one in, one out" policy the rest of us were following to exit a crowded train at Metro Center. She got wedged out and then elbowed me in the stomach. Made me wish I was a girl so I could pull a Heather.
Eggbert, well here's the thing, I spent alot of time in Philly, and I had an abusive ex husband, unfortunately, so I have learned to get loud, aggressive, and fight back if anyone puts their hands on me for no reason whatsoever. I've cursed people out, shoved back, hollered, given the bird, whatever. I don't tolerate people putting their hands on me. Ever.
Wait. Metro police told the OP to take a photo? Doesn't that seem like...bad advice? I mean if the guy's really contemplating some bad things, wouldn't having a photo taken likely infuriate him?

Sounds dumb to me.
1 reply · active 631 weeks ago
I don't know why taking his photo would infuriate him.

Anyone who is in a public place should know that they have no expectation of privacy, and can be stared at, or have their photograph taken, by absolutely anyone.
Bitter Brew's avatar

Bitter Brew · 631 weeks ago

Re: Examiner article on harassment. Props to Liz Essley for including the Stessel flirting/harassment quote in the piece. Metro should not be allowed to tout its anti-harassment campaign without being reminded of that!
Kathryn Aegis's avatar

Kathryn Aegis · 631 weeks ago

Okay, I don't know what set of laws the Metro Police are operating under, but the DC Code spells out a rather specific set of criterea for stalking and harassment. Whatever they call 'physical harassment', it's not required under DC Law. I urge the woman involved to look up the regs online and file a report with the MPD. He may be following her around outside of the Metro, because it seems like he knows where to find her now.
1 reply · active 631 weeks ago
The OP should take very active steps. The staring is incidental here, it's the following that is the issue. She should talk to the DC Police. If possible, she should set up a "sting" with someone else taking photos. And she should get some pepper spray or some other weapon.
asdf, I wouldn't confront the man, either. even though a video would be helpful, I'd rather press the emergency button the train if a threshold point was met. but would that tick him, too? could I try to do it discretely? need to always keep alert of the people around you- people with cell phones, headphones, magazines are easy target for stalkers and criminals
3 replies · active 631 weeks ago
First make sure it is working and the operator will respond. If you are in the third car or behind it it will not work because the 1000s are bellied (thank you metro ignoring physics to try for PR). In front of that it is anyone's guess but there is also the matter of the driver who may ignore it. The best thing is to move to one of the first two cars (if possible) and press the alarm there.

I have found pressing an alarm helps more than not as the perp will want to get out of the area before the authorities arrived. I was once cornered on an elevator so managed to run out of it to a fire alarm pull box. Ok, a trip to the police station was the result, but it was just filing a complaint and a ride back. After having just been threatened with worse it was the preferable path.
Try to discreetly get a photograph each time you see him, with the time/date stamp turned on your phone. You don't have to be looking through the lense to get a photo. Actually, it might not hurt for him to know that you are taking photos and logging his movements. Stalkers tend to choose their victims carefully, people who they think they can intimidate.
Kathryn, that's why, if I see someone I don't like the look of, or a guy getting a "little" too close and it's not a crowded train or platform, I just casually "adjust" my purse on my arm, so that my pepper spray cannister is visible. It just lets them know, without my having to say a word, that I see them, and I will not be afraid to spray the person who thinks they need to try messing with me. Mind you, I am not talking about just random glances or whatnot. I'm talking about guys who get too close, who make me uncomfortable.
stessel sounds like a chief idiot
This column sounds like Penthouse Forum for paranoids.
4 replies · active 631 weeks ago
Well, I hope you'll never encounter what some of us have encountered. Then again, maybe you'll not be so quick to judge someone as "paranoid" DKB. Since WMATA has a culture of laziness and uncaring, we have to look out for ourselves. If that is "paranoia" to you, well I am sorry to hear that.
you must be a lucky enough to live the luxurious lifestyle of driving a car in the comfort of your own personal space on your way to work, DKB? don't post if you can't provide advice for a serious issue.
Oh, it's so not paranoia. If you've lived in DC for 5 minutes and are a young-ish female, you learn to spot the creepers a mile away. And, yes, the first sign that someone is creeping on you is often staring. Weirdos have one kind of stare (kind of blank or crazy-looking), flirters another (trying to give you a "slick" look), and gropers yet another (looking for their opportunity, particularly looking at prime groping spots on your body). Knowing the difference can save you harassment or worse.
Right. You don't even have to be youngish to get the predator stare from some men; I've had a similar problem several times at a bus stop I frequent, and I'm oldish. Anyone belittling the idea that staring can be harassing (in the general sense, not necessarily the legal sense) just hasn't experienced it. It's a thing.
Stan Dessel's avatar

Stan Dessel · 631 weeks ago

One person's armed robbery is another person's spreading around of the wealth. You got home, didn't you? You're welcome.
Has anyone been in contact with Inspector Lang, who helped catch some of these pervs in the past? (http://unsuckdcmetro.blogspot.com/2011/03/unsuck-readers-account-leads-to-arrest.html)
With regards to odd staring dude, there's nothing illegal about staring at someone, and the woman may be unusually concerned about it being menacing or stalking for any number of reasons. That said, if you feel threatened you should feel free to bring it to Metro police. They could decide to investigate or decide you're a loon. Their call. And, if they investigate, they might decide there's nothing to it.
Ever n Anon's avatar

Ever n Anon · 631 weeks ago

I am so STUNNED at the wealth of insensitive comments on today's post, Unsuck. Who are these people?

We are talking about a guy with a gun robbing people and another who is stalking one or more people in a scary menacing manner.

And the cops can do nothing mainly because nobody's dead or raped yet?

And where do the commenters go today? Political bashing. WTF?
2 replies · active 631 weeks ago
People being robbed at gun point is wrong. People being stabbed or worse is wrong too. Metro is public transit. When you walk down the street the same shit can happen to you.
People looking at others funny? People thinking that others are stalking them? This borders on paranoia and general male hating. Like who really walks around thinking that all guys are creeps that look at them? I bet some of these posters do. I'm sure that some of the 700, 000 people that ride metro are criminals, insane, looking to hurt someone, but thankfully its not even close to the majority. How much of the staring bs is all in your head vs really happening? How many of us live in fear all the time of being raped or hurt when in public? There's a lot of hyperbole here that you need to stop and think about.
If you're a reasonable person, it's NOT just paranoia. When I've noticed someone staring (and I mean intently, not just staring off into space and I happen to be in the way) at me, and gave them a dirty look, if they were ALSO a decent person they looked ashamed and away. But the creeps don't look away. If you look back at them, they take that as an invitation. A great example is several months ago. Sitting on the Metro, minding my own business, and I feel the stare. I look up, and there's this guy staring at me from about 3 seats away. I quickly looked back down, but it was too late. He moved to 2 seats away, then the seat in front of me, then stood up next to me, and, just as he started to move in closer and made an attempt to brush me I jumped up and headed for the other end of the car. Fortunately, we were approaching my stop, and I made like I wasn't getting off (as he was repeating his "move a little closer every few seconds" move toward me AGAIN), and then jumped out as the doors were closing. Not the first time, probably won't be the last. I doubt I'd call the police on him, but had I not noticed him and he managed to "make his move" OR it wasn't broad daylight in a car with a number of other passengers in it IN town where stops are close together and I can make an easier escape, who knows? I don't hate men. I hate men who pull stunts to get my attention when I'm clearly not interested in anything but my facebook page and getting home.
FYI- OP said the creeper was in Kramerbooks (Dupont), too. It somewhat goes to show his real intentions when arriving by himself, not being interested in books or food, and leaving by himself after 25 min of staring at people and not buying anything or picking up a book.
Seriously beware, girls, and report if you see! The more reports, the higher priority this issue will get. I guarantee there is a milieu of chicks out there who ride the orange line who have seen him.
Wow. Lots of ignorant garbage in these comments.

I hope this staring creep gets caught before things escalate.
1 reply · active 631 weeks ago
I don't know why he would be 'caught' since he hasn't committed a crime.

Under District law, in order to to qualify as stalking, an individual must engage in a course of conduct against a victim.

Per D.C. Code § 22-3132, (8) "To engage in a course of conduct" means directly or indirectly, or through one or more third persons, in person or by any means, on 2 or more occasions, to:

(A) Follow, monitor, place under surveillance, threaten, or communicate to or about another individual;

(B) Interfere with, damage, take, or unlawfully enter an individual's real or personal property or threaten or attempt to do so; or

(C) Use another individual's personal identifying information.

________________________________

By District law, simply staring at someone is not stalking. It would only be stalking if the alleged stalker actually followed the alleged victim, not once but on at least two separate occasions. If the alleged victim has only seen this person once in her life, the man cannot be guilty of stalking.
Sounds like RGIII has lost a lot of weight after surgery and has fallen on hard times. Dan Snyder is to blame for this.

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