
Remember this boondoggle?
From CS:
There's a lot of talk these days about security on Metro, whether Metro police are visible enough, whether they do enough to contain the young thugs in parts of the system, etc., etc. So I decided to do a little experiment.
For a month, I kept an eye out for whether I saw any cops on my daily commute -- Orange Line from Vienna to Metro Center; then Red Line to Judiciary Square -- plus the occasional trip for lunch. Here's what I found:
7/18:
7/19:
7/20:
7/21:
7/22: Lunchtime Red Line: Cop boarded at Metro Center, immediately shut himself in vacant operator's cab and began texting. (I looked in the cab and saw his thumbs a-twitter when I got off two stops later. Head down, he didn't notice me.)
7/25:
7/26: Morning inbound: Cop boarded at Vienna; rode in train operator's cab until Farragut West, frequently yucking it up with the operator. (Laughter audible in the first car.)
7/27:
7/28:
7/29: (No info -- took the day off)
8/1:
8/2:
8/3:
8/4:
8/5:
8/8:
8/9:
8/10:
8/11:
8/12:
8/15:
8/16: Morning inbound: Cop walking along Red Line platform at Metro Center.
8/17: Two-fer -- morning inbound: cop walking along Orange Line platform at Metro Center; lunchtime Red Line: cop exiting platform at Metro Center.
8/18:
8/19:
Of course, my ride doesn't take me into all parts of the system, like parts of the Green Line, the eastern end of the Orange Line, or where the school hooligans run wild on the Red Line.
Nevertheless, what I observed doesn't exactly strike me as a robust presence.
I see my local Fairfax County police more often when I'm out and about at home. But whether you think five touches over a month is good or bad, what I found remarkable was that in each instance, the officers were doing nothing to engage with the system, the passengers, or their surroundings.
In two instances, they literally walled themselves off from contact. They could have chosen to move through cars, be visible, or talk with passengers, but didn't. They also could have been on the lookout for what seems to be a growing problem of eating/drinking on the trains. In the other three instances, the cops were just bustling from one place to another and looked like any other passenger. In all, there was plainly no effort to act like a cop on the beat.
Why does any of this matter? As Metro police have said repeatedly, the key to disruption is unpredictability. Confronted with the unusual, or encountering authorities where they don't expect them, would-be terrorists will retire for another day, police said.
But it's a little hard to shake up the routine if the cops aren't doing much to start with.
@WidderShinns · 709 weeks ago
One take · 709 weeks ago
The specific officers to whom you are referring are simply making sure that no woman commits the dangerous felony of ‘Droppin’ It Like It’s Haaawwwwwt’.
cops not abound · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
@katmoo14 · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
Ever and Anon · 709 weeks ago
"I’m still on the fence on whether you’re trying to help or just love the attention."
YES! We want attention!!! Some attention to our safety please.
· 709 weeks ago
@aarontobler · 709 weeks ago
Casey · 709 weeks ago
Sizzle · 709 weeks ago
I tweeted Metro about it, and they said it was "just visibility" and that it wasn't a cause for concern. What the hell does that even mean? I find it hard to believe that MTPD would be walking around with drug/bomb dogs for no reason when they hardly ever patrol in the first place. Just curious if anyone else has any thoughts on this.
Metro Ryder · 709 weeks ago
It seems what all metro employees (police, station managers, etc) do best is check out women's asses.
MadAsHeck · 709 weeks ago
James · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
And what's the big deal, really? At least they're visible when "fare enforcement" is being performed. As much complaining as there is over lack of visibility, be thankful they're out there.
DCRider · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
BTW....you do realize the fines off of tickets and citations for the various offenses don't go to Metro, don't you? They go to the local governments where the violation was committed. Metro doesn't profit--other than to have people pay the correct fares. I'm only referencing that in the event you believe the police enforce this so Metro makes some sort of "extra" money off of it. It doesn't.
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
Fare evasion, thought it may seem to be minor, is theft. And MANY fugitives and wanted persons who would not have otherwise had an encounter with police have been apprehended after evading the fare. Very often in police work, little stops yield big results.
RGG · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
Anonerly Ev er · 709 weeks ago
Metro Ryder · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
anon · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
bll · 709 weeks ago
Just as well behaved customers see uniformed officers patrolling the stations, so too do the troublemakers...and clearly they take their trouble elsewhere. It's possible that adding in some plain clothes officers could help alleviate some of the smaller issues (eating. drinking, spitting?) but it's also possible that they will take full advantage of their anonymity and do even less 'patrolling.'
guest · 709 weeks ago
CS · 709 weeks ago
Kate · 709 weeks ago
guest · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
And the cop "hiding in the operator's cab" frequently catches people doing things they aren't supposed to be doing because he/she _isn't_ visible.
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
VirginiaWriter · 709 weeks ago
Fred Smith · 709 weeks ago
coponmetro · 709 weeks ago
FIRE TABORN
MoreYellingAtWalls · 709 weeks ago
There are even songs dedicated to the hatred of police.
If you can't take some criticism of taking necessary action, go be a mall cop.
If you can't determine what action is necessary during your duties as a cop, I hope you're fired.
Engaging the public is different than messing with people and/or doing nothing.
A verbal warning from a police officer would certainly make me stop eating on the train. Who would complain about this? It may not keep them eating in the future, but a ticket may not either.
Enforcement of the (IMO) trivial rules (ie: eating, drinking) is less important than being present and aware in the system.
I think even saying "hello" or engaging the public in ANY way would go very far for the MTPD.
I've only been stared through or looked past if cops are patrolling a fare gate (I am male, and without ba-donk-a-donk) and generally see cops either staring at the fare gates or shooting the shit.
I have noticed attentive cops many times at fare gates. This is unimportant to me.
One time I did notice a whole bunch of cops (6, 7) in gallery place, some along the platform and some in the station. I was impressed!
A few were even said hello to people (though that may have been bc they were told to stand along the platform and didn't have cop buddies to mingle with and staring at a crowd of people was too awkward...)
n2deep · 709 weeks ago
i was at a station this past weekend when a couple officers detained a couple youths as possible robbery suspects. the cameras were blazing away! one officer asked a couple of the camera wielders to back away and they both refused to budge an inch. afraid to miss something. one of the youths was being beligerent and not really cooperating. so a little force was used to get his hand behind his back. i am waiting for the police brutality screams to start.
bottom line is people want police presence and a show of force but are the first to complain when they get it. sad....very sad
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
ANOTHERCOP · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
Guest · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
I was talking to a MTPD officer a couple of weeks ago about the iPod robberies and if they are still occurring. He said that, try as they might, people still aren't getting it and are getting smacked nearly every day. He said he mentioned to a passenger on the train recently how it may be in her best interest to conceal her property while in the system.
Her response: "When I want your advise I'll ask for it."
Thankless job.....
Guest · 709 weeks ago
Also, while I understand that warning members of the public about potentially risky behavior is part of a cop's job, maybe if the MTPD was actually doing its job properly I would be able to take my ipod out on the train without fear of being robbed? A MTPD officer telling people that it's not safe to take their ipod out on the train is kind of like my plumber telling me not to run water in my bathroom sink. I mean, yeah, I appreciate the warning - but maybe we could fix the underlying problem, rather than just warn me away from doing something that I'm supposed to be able to do?
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
But you compare this type of robbery to water in the sink, but it is a uselesl example. It's like telling your kids to slow down while driving because they might kill themselves, then blaming it on the roads when they are involved in an accident.
The problem here is people who are victims. Don't MAKE yourself a victim, and blame in on everyone else. I have worked in plain clothes throughout the system often and seen people sitting there completely unaware of their surroundings with their IPhone or other electronic device out for someone to grab as if to say "sure, take it". You also have to take responsibility when it comes to crime prevention.
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
And by the way, do you lock your car doors? House doors?
Guest · 709 weeks ago
I would be more receptive to that argument if the (apparently) small number of officers that MTPD does have deployed appeared to actually be patrolling agressively. Why add still more officers if the ones that we already have aren't actually patrolling? Do we need even more cops standing around the station manager booths in even bigger clusters? Would that help reduce crime?
"The problem here is people who are victims. Don't MAKE yourself a victim, and blame in on everyone else."
And here I thought the problem was the criminals. Good to know that the real problem is the victims...
RGG · 709 weeks ago
Ride around to Minnesota Avenue, Deanwood, Anacostia, Congress Heights, and you'll likely see a few. But then again, you'll actually have to get out of Northwest..... or Bethesda....
guest · 709 weeks ago
guest · 709 weeks ago
Your analogy sucks, because the roads aren't employees that were hired for the express purpose of preventing car accidents. Nice try, though.
RGG · 709 weeks ago
By "doing its job properly" what do you propose MTPD do? Assign an officer to each of Metro's train cars on every train in service? That's impossible, of course. I constantly hear announcements, see posters, etc., warning people to be on their toes about this activity.
It isn't necessarily that people use their electronic devices, but it's the people that sit in a "half-comatose" state, next to the doors of the train, with so much other crap in their possession that they couldn't chase the little thugs if they wanted to. Normally, if it's simply kept put away there isn't a problem. I know for a fact that many arrests are made for these offenses, but so many people have _some_ type of electronic device that there are way too many potential targets. Having earbuds in your ear, deafening yourself to the world around you, just doesn't seem like a smart move to me anyways. It results in a loss of "situational awareness."
I don't know what you consider "the underlying problem" but I know there are only about 20-24 officers on foot patrol within the entire system at any time for over 100 miles of track. Would a 100 square mile city only have 20-24 officers patrolling it per shift? Then you're bound to lose a few to arrests, details--now that D.C. schools are back in session, expect to lose officers to "bad" stations to keep an eye on the kids (interestingly, this only seems to be needed at D.C. stations---I wonder why?). The officers that work during the day are now responsible for escorting Metro's money people to the various vendors throughout the day, now . You may have seen these "carts" getting pushed through the station. This ties up several of the already few officers for a few hours during the busy morning rush time that were previously available. There used to be a special "team" that performed this duty which didn't interfere with patrol duties. There are lots of decisions from upper management that are purely $$$$ motivated, not common sense motivated.
And if the plumber tells you not to "run the water" and you do it anyways, and your house floods, do you blame the plumber?
I never believe the "victim" is the bad guy, but people have to use some common sense. This stuff is happening all the time. Why risk it? Most of the time it's "non-violent" but not always. I saw a young lady from California at Branch Avenue that was punched in the face by a thug-ette on an empty train. After busting her lip he calmly took her handbag, emptied on the floor of the train, and went through it looking for anything "good." MTPD arrested him. See, it does happen, you just don't hear about it.
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
Don't make yourself a target. We don't live in a perfect world, so you need to use some common sense. Like you lock your house and car doors, don't hold your expensive electronics out for someone to snatch. Just as you wouldn't blame the local police because your house was broken into, don't blame Transit Police because your IPod was stolen.
Take some responsibility and play a part in crime prevention rather than expecting to do whatever you like with no consequences.
One last thing-maybe that officer is standing there with another officer or two because, unlike other departments, their backup may be 15 minutes away. How would you like to be by YOURself with no help in sight when you are fighting for your life?
Guest · 709 weeks ago
Doesn't sound fun to me. But then again, I didn't take a job as a MTPD officer. There are many jobs that I wouldn't want to do. But if someone decides to apply for such a job and accepts a paycheck in exchange for doing it, I still expect that person to actually try their best. If you're not willing to try, please quit so that someone else who might actually be willing to do the work has a chance to try it.
RGG · 709 weeks ago
Yep....and you're name isn't on "The Wall" either. Two are...
You lucked out.
guest · 709 weeks ago
Meanwhile, five of WMATA's customers were murdered in 2010 alone. Who knows how many of those people would still be alive if MTPD wasn't standing around in a group by the station manager's office because they were too scared to go down into the station and do their job?
And before you disagree with that characterization, notice that "ACOP" essentially admitted this in his above post...
RGG · 709 weeks ago
There were recent stories--here included--about the MTPD radio system being screwed up so officers were teaming up. It seems to me that that would be a smart move. Not to mention that MTPD officers are subjected to the same screwed up Metro system that everyone else is, with train delays galore, so the fact that a "back-up" may not arrive in a timely manner would encourage that "congregating" behavior.
"they were too scared to go down into the station and do their job? "
I don't think that's what "ACOP" was stating. Generalizing that all MTPD officers are "scared" is a bit much, don't you think? I don't think anyone really expects ONE officer to jump into the middle of a fight between 20 "thugettes" by him/herself--only to get turned on by the mob and hurt (Personally, I say let 'em beat the crap out of each other until they tire out!!).
Guest · 709 weeks ago
As I have already said many times, I want them to patrol aggressively on the platforms and in the trains, rather than camping out around the station manager's office in groups or hiding out in the operator compartments.
"I don't know what you consider "the underlying problem" but I know there are only about 20-24 officers on foot patrol within the entire system at any time for over 100 miles of track."
Let's try having the cops actually patrol and see what that's like before we decide we need to hire more. We won't know whether or not the current number of MTPD is sufficient to control crime until they start actually trying to control crime.
"And if the plumber tells you not to "run the water" and you do it anyways, and your house floods, do you blame the plumber?"
I don't blame the plumber for my turning on the water. I DO blame the plumber for not being able to fix my plumbing like he was hired to do. If I call a plumber because my house floods when I try to run the water, and his response is "so don't run the water then!", I'm going to start looking for a new plumber pretty quickly.
RGG · 709 weeks ago
Sure....until your kid gets locked up for eating French Fries....
It used to be said: "Take care of the little things, and the big things tend to take care of themselves....."
But that was before "YouTube...."
guest · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
MTPD puts out plain clothes teams frequently at the "bad" stations, acting as decoys, to purposely get "robbed." It has had some success from what I've been told.
Most of the officers are detailed to certain stations in the "peak" times to try and deter the "youths" from running amok. Obviously, this is going to take away from other area getting service, but it's a "calculated risk." Where is something bad likely to occur.... Minnesota Avenue----or Braddock Road?
So, if there are 20-24 on a shift, and half of those are tied up on "school details" while half of the rest are assigned to protect the "revenue carts" well, as you can see that doesn't leave many to be "visible."
Guest · 709 weeks ago
Guest · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
If you have a _real_ complaint like that, MTPD has an Internal Affairs just like everyone else. Or you can simply call to speak to a supervisor to air your grievance. Keep in mind though that normally, unless it's a violation of some "General Order" or written directive, there isn't much that can me done. Being a jerk may not qualify.
MadAsHeck · 709 weeks ago
Man watching woman walk: Hey hot stuff!
Woman: What do you want?
Man: nothing, I'm jus' patrollin' da platform.
Guest · 709 weeks ago
Medallion system is a pointless idea for DC cabs. Solution is much simpler than that- fair, transparent regulation is needed to weed the sucky cab companies and drivers out. Just this morning, a co-worker had to run after a cab that hit a cyclist then fled the scene. Luckily, my co-worker managed to confront the cab driver and get the attention of a passing cop. Cab company in question? None other than Luxury Cab, part of United Ventures Consortium, for which Haimanot Bizuayehu is the chairman, and a very vocal opponent of Gray administration proposed taxi regulation (which does suck, in all fairness).
Kara · 709 weeks ago
Ellinad · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
boredRider · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
-When you see that officer sitting in his cruiser and not down walking the platform, he isn't lazy. He is there in his car so he can quickly respond to calls for service and to back up other officers.
-When you see that officer standing by the faregates and not on the platform, it may be because he has radio reception there and not on the platform and needs to be able to hear radio traffic if something occurs.
There are countless other examples of how an officer's actions (or inaction) can easily be misconstrued. My point? Don't automatically assume the worst.
Be safe
Tim · 709 weeks ago
anon5 · 709 weeks ago
ACOP · 709 weeks ago
sendhelp · 709 weeks ago
RGG · 709 weeks ago
Curious? Did you bother to report it to anyone??
Guest · 707 weeks ago